gitaneusa.com Forum Index Register FAQ Memberlist Search

gitaneusa.com Forum Index » Vintage Gitane » Late 60's TdF?
Post new topic  Reply to topic View previous topic :: View next topic 
Late 60's TdF? 
PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2006 6:10 am Reply with quote
Paul C LaMourie
Joined: 11 Sep 2006
Posts: 4
Never posted here before, but here goes.

I pulled what I think is a 60's TdF out of the back of a junkman's truck not long ago. Most closely resembles the '60 catalog #102 on this site. here's what I know:

531 Tubing (decal still readable)
Gitane decal on downtube says "Professionnel"
Braze-ons for tire pump on top tube like in '60 #102 photo (pump is gone)
Nervex lugs
Durifort forks (decal)
Stronglight Model 54 (or 55?) Crankset
Campy Gran Sport components
Ideale Model 49 saddle
Normandy hubs
Atom quick releases
Mavic rims for sew ups

Bike appears to have been equipped with fenders as it came from the factory -- they are unpainted aluminum, with a stripe down a stamped groove in the middle that matches the frame color, which is sort of a burnt orange. The bike has a rear rack and dynamo/headlight that were probably fitted by the dealer. It is also equipped with some kind of front wheel lock attached to the front fork (WiseLock?) that appears to be for the purpose of preventing the front wheel from being stolen.

Mechanical condition is excellent, cosmetic is so-so. I replaced the dry-rotted tires (interesting experience having to glue the tires on), fitted new cables and handlebar tape (Mafac brake lever hoods were also dry rotted so now they're gone), and replaced the rotted leather toe straps with nylon ones I had laying around. I just have fun riding with my wife and kids, mostly on crushed limestone trails. One of these days maybe I'll fit wider clincher rims and tires, keeping the originals for the road.
View user's profile Send private message
 
PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2006 4:00 pm Reply with quote
sandranian
Site Admin
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 2701
Location: Southern California
Thanks for sharing that with the list. I have heard so many stories about people finding bikes...and I have yet to pull one out of the trash! The nearest I came was finding a Peugeot with 531 that was left out for the trash to pick up...but it was too big for me and I don't like peugeot's anyways, so I ended up parting it out and selling it. Not a very fun story.

Anyhow, I am interested in seeing pics of your bike. The 60's stuff is pretty rare.

_________________
Stephan Andranian
Costa Mesa, CA
www.gitaneusa.com
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
 
PostPosted: Wed Sep 13, 2006 8:15 pm Reply with quote
Paul C LaMourie
Joined: 11 Sep 2006
Posts: 4
Here are some pics...can anybody ID/Date this baby?







View user's profile Send private message
Beautiful 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 14, 2006 1:43 am Reply with quote
Paul Wiseman
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 584
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Wow, that's beautiful. Can anyone explain the decal on the seat tube. It appears to have both a french flag and union jack???????

_________________
Wisey
Brisbane, Australia
1974 Paris - Nice
1985 Defi
1985 Victoire
1985 Victoire (yes, another one!)
1985 Professionnel
View user's profile Send private message
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 14, 2006 6:27 am Reply with quote
sandranian
Site Admin
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 2701
Location: Southern California
That is earlier than the late 60's...I would date it at early 1960's "Tour de France". A top notch collector's piece, for sure. What a find!

You can get some of the rust off of the chrome areas with copper wool (like steel wool, only copper). After you have removed the rust, put some polish or wax on the area to help prevent rust...the bike will rust from moisture in the air if not protected! Also, I would remove that rack, which seems to have been put on afterwards. Ido not think that the fenders are stock, but they may be...what with the matching red stripe and all.... I would turn it into an early 1960's racer, as it was meant to be...but if you are more the touring type, you could leave that stuff on. Just my own unsolicited opinion.

Regarding trail riding, those bikes were designed for use on bad French dirt roads, and should handle the trails very well. No need to replace wheels...in fact, I think I would have to "liberate" the bike from you if decided to put new wheels on it! That bike was built to go FAST on bad roads.

I would be interested in some close-up shots of the seat tube decal, which I have seen before, but never close up. Also the head tube logo is the old style, along with the Gitane script on the down tube. Very rare and impressive bicycle. If you ever want to sell it.....

Please some more close up pictures of the decals (throughout) and lug details! I would appreciate some better pics to add it to the GitaneUSA website, if that was OK. That is one of the earliest Gitanes that I have run accross in the USA.

Where do you live? I would love to take a look at that bike, and would pay you for the chance to help you restore it.

_________________
Stephan Andranian
Costa Mesa, CA
www.gitaneusa.com
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 14, 2006 9:33 am Reply with quote
Paul C LaMourie
Joined: 11 Sep 2006
Posts: 4
Now you've got me thinking...

Everything I know about bikes from this era I have learned in the three months or so since I paid the junkman $40 for this one. The several bikes in the truck caught my wife's eye, the leather saddle on this one caught mine, then the ornate lugs, then the rims which were absolutely and miraculously straight when spun. Total sunk cost to date is about $100. This may be the start of a new hobby (the riding, not necessarily the restoration). What started out as:

"My other bike was stolen. Where can I get a cheap replacement that I can ride with the kids this weekend?" became:

"This old bike is pretty cool...how can I get it rolling again at minimum cost/time?" which became:

"You can find anything on the web...I wonder if there's somebody out there who can tell me how old this bike is?"

And here we are.

I have always been attracted to beautiful but functional, well-built products of an earlier era (go ahead and say it, "retrogrouch") that are intended to be used. Hence the attraction to this.

My primary consideration in this situation is time. With a wife and four school-age kids to keep track of, as you can imagine it is at a premium. Maybe this project is better suited to somebody like yourself, with the time, resources, and knowledge to restore this bike to its former glory and the time and inclination to take proper care of it when it's done. What I would need to get out of the deal is a bike that is either "old" or "retro", but not so pristine and collectible that I'm afraid to ride it.

While we both contemplate how to make that happen, let me know what pics you would like and from what angles, and I will try to provide, this time during the daylight to eliminate the flash glare. You are welcome to use any/all on the site.

Are there any numbers I can look for to better nail down the provenance? There is a number on the rear dropout, and I believe one on the bottom bracket (I think that is what it is called) in addition to the word "Nervex" and the lug angles.

BTW, the bike has two municipal license stickers on the frame (one of which unfortunately may be covering up a 531 decal) and I tried to track down the provenance that way to no avail. One is from my community, and I got the impression that the junkman got it off the curb in my neighborhood for nothing, then fortuitously sold it to me 20 mins later. Sure would be great to run that down and see if the former owner has the tire pump and/or any paperwork. That would be a home run.

I live in Naperville, IL a large suburb West of Chicago. You are welcome to come anytime, though I suspect there is a bike you will want to take with you when you leave...
View user's profile Send private message
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 14, 2006 10:36 am Reply with quote
sandranian
Site Admin
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 2701
Location: Southern California
The 531 sticker is already visible on the downtube, and there wouldn't be another one on the bike. The license information would be interesting to track down, as it may give you an idea regarding the date.

The numbers on the rear dropout is the serial number, but they are notorious for revealing little to nothing (ah, the French!). There were a few years in the 1980s where they actually had a date code, but that's about it. If there is a "6-" number on it, that may be a date code.

As for the pictures, I am not sure...pics of all the decals for sure, including the durifort fork decal, the dropouts, and any other cool stuff, like the seat clamp cluster. What brand is the saddle? Ideale? Ideale was the French answer to the Brooks saddle and was very popular then. Also, a picture of the clamp right below the front derailleur.

I lived in Chicago for three years during law school. Love it there...but not a big fan of Illinois' Spring weather. That bike is my size (54 or 55, right?), so anytime you want to part with it, let me know!

_________________
Stephan Andranian
Costa Mesa, CA
www.gitaneusa.com
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
chrome bits.... 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 14, 2006 2:14 pm Reply with quote
Paul Wiseman
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 584
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Just before anyone goes to the chrome work with steel or copper wool. We have a product here called "bright-shine". It is for polishing alloy wheels on cars, and comes from the local auto shop. It is made from real wool impregnated with a very mild abrasive agent. Works a treat and leaves no marks behind. I'm sure there's something like that in the States.

_________________
Wisey
Brisbane, Australia
1974 Paris - Nice
1985 Defi
1985 Victoire
1985 Victoire (yes, another one!)
1985 Professionnel
View user's profile Send private message
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 5:12 pm Reply with quote
Robert B.
Joined: 14 Mar 2006
Posts: 8
Location: the "Chronically Cloudy Clime" of Oregon
Paul,

I apologize for being tardy with respect to chiming in on this discussion, however, I have been out of town for a bit and have only just returned. Besides, I will herein publicly confess to not checking the GitaneUSA vintage forum on a daily basis due to other priorities in life (...sad but true, sorry to say).

First off, let me state that I believe your rescue of this particular bicycle is most fortuitous for all concerned. Not only did this fine bike manage to dodge a date with death at the hands of the recycling folks, but you are now the proud owner of one of the earliest examples of handiwork wrought from Marchoul amongst the august members of this forum. Regardless as to whether you ultimately keep this bicycle or subsequently offer it up to those who haunt this little corner of cyberspace, it is most certainly going to end up in the hands of an appreciative owner - and that, in and of itself, will go a long way toward ensuring the long term survival of this specimen.

Now, onto the matter of just what this bicycle is, and is not.

You have in hand what I believe to be a vintage 1965 or 1966 Gitane model Professional and NOT a "Tour de France" as it has been referred to thus far in this thread. The Professional model actually pre-dates the official Tour de France which might prove to be a bit confusing to some because the early 1960's Gitane model 102 was at times referred to as a "Tour de France" (...for an example of this, please see that piece of literature dating from 1960 posted elsewhere on this website under the "Catalogues" section) but that was only a secondary "marketing" term and, in fact, the words "Tour de France" were nowhere to be found on any model 102. Also, for purposes of reference, your Professional model would have had an M.S.R.P. of $169.95 USD in 1964 and it was just one step down from what was then the top-of-the-line Superbe model in the Gitane hierarchy. While I have done my best to carefully review those photographs that you have posted, I must confess that the combination of my failing eyesight, far from optimal lighting, and your less than steady hand with a flash camera, all add up to my not being able to tell you as much as I might otherwise given clearer pictures (...or younger eyes). That said, here is what I can tell you based upon the published specifications from 1964 (...and yes, Stephan, one of these days I PROMISE that I will get around to digitizing all of this background material and sending a copy off to you):

The Gitane Professional of 1964 had a frameset that was constructed from French metric sized Reynolds 531 tubing mated together using Nervex Professional lugs. The front fork, however, was crafted from lightweight Durifort tubing and fitted with a chrome plated Vagner flat-top crown. Both the back one-third of the rear stays as well as the lower one-third of the front fork also featured exposed chrome plating. Rather than the ubiquitous Simplex dropouts that adorned the vast majority of later "bike boom" Gitane's, the mid-1960's Professional featured Campagnolo 1010 dropouts having traditional rack eyelets. The drivetrain originally consisted of a pair of venerable Lyotard 460-D alloy pedals with Christophe chromed steel toe clips and leather straps, mated to a Stronglight Pedalier 49 crankset having Specialites T.A. 52 and 45 tooth adaptor type chain rings (...this is one of those fittings where your example differs from 1964 vintage "stock" trim to the extent that your bike has been equipped with a "lesser" Stronglight 3-Pin crankset more in keeping with the Hosteller, Grand Prix, 102, and De Luxe models from the same era) which transferred power via a Yellorex chain back to an Atom 14-24 five speed freewheel. Front and rear derailleurs, as well as down tube shifters and shift cable guides, were all from the long gone Campagnolo Sport gruppo that debuted back in the 1950's (...whereas your bike is actually fitted with slightly more upscale Campagnolo Gran Sport equipment). The brakeset on the 1964 Professional featured the now legendary MAFAC Tiger calipers paired with MAFAC Dural Course 121 levers having half hoods (...if, indeed, your bike is still equipped with a set of Tigers, guard these carefully as they will fetch upwards of $300 to $400 USD for a nice used pair on eBay courtesy of the fine Francophiles over in Japan. But it looks to me as though your bike is currently fitted with the much more common and less costly MAFAC Racer calipers - although I cannot tell whether yours are the early "Dural Forge" variety consistent with a mid 1960's build date or the later version actually marked "Racer" on their leading arm, which would be strong indication as to their being replacement units). The wheelset for the 1964 Professional model would have been comprised of 36 hole MAVIC alloy Piste track rims laced three cross pattern with Robergel "Trois Etoiles" or "Three Stars" double butted chrome plated spokes to Campagnolo Record high flange hubs (...here would be yet another slight difference, as your bike uses less expensive "home market" Normandy hubs with Atom quick release skewers), with D'Alessandro 145 tubular tires. Other accoutrements would include Pivo Professional dural handlebars and stem, a Stronglight V4 Competition headset, and a chrome plated Durifort seat post topped with an Ideale 48 Record leather saddle (...although you mentioned that your bike has a model 49 Ideale). Additionally, all Professional models included accessories in the form of genuine Duralumin fenders (...or mudguards as the Europeans would refer to them) with color matched accents (...so, YES, these were factory fitted items - if you do choose to remove them, DO NOT THROW THEM AWAY!!!) and a professional Ad-Hoc polished aluminum tire pump that would have been safley nestled between the braze-ons affixed to the underside of its top tube. As you opined in your original post to this forum, both the rear rack and the dynamo powered headlight must have bee added at some point as the only model of Gitane to feature these items during that era would have been their Hosteller touring bike.

My belief that your particular Professional dates from 1965 or 1966 is based upon its striking similarity with respect to the 1964 specifications as outlined above, in conjunction with the fact that Cycles Gitane had a well documented tendency to re-equip given models with successively less "upscale" componentry over time so that they might trade on established model names, while continually trying to meet very specific price points in an inflationary market.

Given its vintage, this bicycle was in all likelihood sold either directly or indirectly through Wheel Goods Corporation based out of Minneapolis, Minnesota. Back then, Wheel Goods was the largest stateside importer of Gitane bicycles, as well as a major supplier of cycling sundries throughout the U.S. (...and in the Upper Midwest / Great Lakes region in particular - remember, you found the bike in Naperville, Illinois) acting as both a wholesaler to various local cycling shops as well as a retailer with direct sales to consumers (...primarily through their Handbook of Cycl-ology mail order catalog, although they did also maintain a storefront under the name Cycle Goods located on Hennepin Avenue in Minneapolis proper).

_________________
Robert B.
...the "Chronically Cloudy Clime" of Oregon
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 9:04 pm Reply with quote
sandranian
Site Admin
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 2701
Location: Southern California
Robert...you have unbelievable knowledge/history. At some point, you should sit down and write a history of Gitane in the USA...I will help with it and add it to the site....

Thank you so much for sharing it with us here.

_________________
Stephan Andranian
Costa Mesa, CA
www.gitaneusa.com
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 5:17 pm Reply with quote
Paul C LaMourie
Joined: 11 Sep 2006
Posts: 4
I promise better pics soon for general interest, but they are certainly not needed for identification purposes -- Robert the "GitaneUSA Oracle of South Dakota" has already ably taken care of that.

Thanks for the history; I still haven't given up on trying to find out which one of my neighbors the junkman got the bike from so I can call at their door in search of the pump and any other tidbits...

PCL
View user's profile Send private message
 
PostPosted: Sat Sep 23, 2006 1:02 pm Reply with quote
Robert B.
Joined: 14 Mar 2006
Posts: 8
Location: the "Chronically Cloudy Clime" of Oregon
Paul et al. (...sorry, but it has such perfect trailing alliteration),

For your edification and viewing pleasure, I have attached a digital image from the 1964 Cycles Gitane export catalog (...which is to say, a published accounting of that which was available domestically in the U.S. - no guarantees with respect to other countries) depicting their then contemporary Professional and Superbe models. I have also attached an advertisement dating from 1967 showing both the MAFAC Tiger as well as the first edition MAFAC Racer centerpull brake calipers. Please note the inscription on the leading arm of the Racer caliper that actually reads 'Dural Forge MAFAC' and not 'MAFAC "RACER"' as seen on later versions. If your Professional was originally equipped with a Racer rather than a Tiger brakeset in contrast to the 1964 catalog specifications, it would most certainly have been of this earlier style. Should your bike have a later version of these Racer calipers affixed, it would be a clear indication that they are replacement units. Now, whether those would be a replacement for an original Tiger or Racer caliper set is a matter open to speculation inasmuch as I do not have exacting details for the 1965 through 1967 editions of the Professional model and, as I mentioned in my previous post, Gitane was notorious for downgrading component specifications over time within a given model line in an effort to economize build costs and thereby hold steady as best they could down line retail pricing.




_________________
Robert B.
...the "Chronically Cloudy Clime" of Oregon
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Late 60's TdF? 
  gitaneusa.com Forum Index » Vintage Gitane
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
All times are GMT - 8 Hours  
Page 1 of 1  

  
  
 Post new topic  Reply to topic  


Powered by phpBB © 2001-2004 phpBB Group
Designed for Trushkin.net | Themes Database.